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Is Jesus God In The Flesh?


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#21 scott

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 11:05 AM

Oh, I'm sorry.

I don't prefer either creation story.

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Harry, you said " Anything Literally " so yes you did contradict yourself.

#22 Harry

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 12:30 PM

There is no contradiction, note the NIV translation:

'''Now the LORD God had formed out of the ground all the beasts of the field…'' (Genesis 2: 19)

God had already created the animals before man. The Hebrew Yatsar, should be translated ''had formed'' not just ''formed''.

There are no contradictions in Genesis, or the Bible for that matter. The only people who are obsessed with proving contradictions are atheists, but none have degrees or education in Hebrew. No Hebrew scholar believes there are contradictions in Genesis.

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Then you admit there are problems with the translation?

I can't help but see a chronological discrepancy between the two stories. One has god creating the animals for man while the other has god creating man after the animals.

#23 Harry

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 12:43 PM

Harry, you said " Anything Literally "  so yes you did contradict yourself.

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Only if you take what I said literally... :rolleyes:

"And therein lies the problem with interpretting anything literally."

The point, Scott, was that two people can interpret the same story differently while still taking what they perceive to be a literal interpretation.

Should you take the story literally? If it was intended to be taken literally, which Ikester claimed it was, then yes.

Is your literal interpretation going to be correct? Probably no more than anyone else's.

#24 scott

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 12:45 PM

Only if you take what I said literally...  :rolleyes:

"And therein lies the problem with interpretting anything literally."

The point, Scott, was that two people can interpret the same story differently while still taking what they perceive to be a literal interpretation.

Should you take the story literally? If it was intended to be taken literally, which Ikester claimed it was, then yes.

Is your literal interpretation going to be correct? Probably no more than anyone else's.

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Are you trying to say that there aren't any absolute truths? Are you saying that reality is subjective?

#25 Harry

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 12:56 PM

Are you trying to say that there aren't any absolute truths?  Are you saying that reality is subjective?

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No, what I AM saying is that even if absolute truths do exist we may not be able to ascertain them.

But I'm an agnostic, so I'm probably not the right person to ask. :rolleyes:

#26 jason78

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 04:19 PM

Is Jesus God? I have often heard some christains say He was not. What are Your thoughts?

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If Jesus was God in human form, why isn't he still alive today?

#27 ikester7579

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 05:16 PM

Harry,

I noticed that you skipped my post. Was making literal sense to what you guys like to use an example of how silly literal is. to much for you to handle?

#28 ikester7579

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 05:19 PM

If Jesus was God in human form, why isn't he still alive today?

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Same reason the god of evolution (Darwin) is not around. Eternal things cannot exist where the laws do not allow it.

#29 jason78

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 05:28 PM

Same reason the god of evolution (Darwin) is not around. Eternal things cannot exist where the laws do not allow it.

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There is no specific law that stops things from living eternally. And even if there were a law that prevented it, there is no reason that a god could not transcend that law.

#30 ikester7579

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Posted 26 August 2010 - 09:10 PM

There is no specific law that stops things from living eternally.  And even if there were a law that prevented it, there is no reason that a god could not transcend that law.

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God is not a law breaker. If He could have died under eternal laws for our sin, there would have been no need for him to come here and be born mortally so that He could die the same way.

Name one life form on this planet that is eternal?

Just because God is God does not mean He can do anything. Being Holy and Righteous means there are limitations because there is also evil.

#31 Ron

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 03:41 AM

Oh, I'm sorry.

I don't prefer either creation story.

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I'm not talking about the Biblical creation story, I'm talking about “Your” take on how the universe/our existence originated.

You see, this is a give and take. You need to provide evidence to support your beliefs to counter any attack you want to make on mine… And keep in mind, communications is a two way street. Intellectual honesty is of utmost importance.

#32 Bex

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 06:06 AM

If Jesus was God in human form, why isn't he still alive today?

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He is alive today, He's eternal because He is God. He rose from the dead to prove He has power of life and death - the ressurection. After He had risen from the dead, He visited His disciples and spoke with them. Thomas could not believe it was really Christ and had to touch the crucifixion holes in order to believe it was truly He. This is where perhaps many relate to Thomas who had to see with his own eyes, feel/touch, because he struggled with having faith.

After this, it was time for Christ to return to The Father and send His Holy Spirit. He said He would be with us to the end of time and He meant it, through the Holy Spirit. He works through the hearts of the faithful, those striving for holiness. So that it is Christ who lives and works through them and reaches others.

Christ told us that if we cannot believe and accept the earthly things He tells us in scripture, how then will we believe the spiritual? Blessed are those who believe and do not see. When Christ rose in body/spirit to the Father, He sent down His Holy Spirit.

#33 jason78

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 06:38 AM

Name one life form on this planet that is eternal?

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Selaginella Lepidophylla.

#34 Ron

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 07:15 AM

Selaginella Lepidophylla.

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You are joking... Right? :blink:

#35 jason78

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 07:27 AM

You are joking... Right?  :blink:

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Not at all.

#36 Ron

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 07:44 AM

Not at all.

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Then back up your assertion that Selaginella Lepidophylla is eternal. And I mean
more than just your opinion, but with hard cold facts. Show how Selaginella Lepidophylla = infinitude

Keep in mind:

Eternal =

1- Lasting for all time without beginning or end

2- Unaffected by the passage of time

3- Something that lasts for all time without beginning or end

Selaginella Lepidophylla doesn’t fit any of the above criteria. But, you just might have some evidence we aren’t privy to. So it would be greatly appreciated







.

#37 Harry

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 12:02 PM

I'm not talking about the Biblical creation story, I'm talking about “Your” take on how the universe/our existence originated.

You see, this is a give and take. You need to provide evidence to support your beliefs to counter any attack you want to make on mine… And keep in mind, communications is a two way street. Intellectual honesty is of utmost importance.

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Why bother, Ron? It's all based on faith and none of it has been observed.

Do you have a degree in sophistry?

#38 Harry

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 12:05 PM

Harry,

I noticed that you skipped my post. Was making literal sense to what you guys like to use an example of how silly literal is. to much for you to handle?

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Sorry, Ikester. I did miss your post.

If the Bible is to be taken literally why is it that you spend so much time explaining how its supposed to be interpreted?

#39 Ron

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 01:55 PM

Sorry, Ikester. I did miss your post.

If the Bible is to be taken literally why is it that you spend so much time explaining how its supposed to be interpreted?

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Again, you are either; mistakenly missing the point, or purposively twisting the point. Where the Bible is written as literally, it is to be taken literally. Where it is written as metaphorically, it is intended to be taken that way. But, even where it is written metaphorically (Psalms, parables etcetera…) it has literal meaning and lessons.

As to why so much time has to be spent explaining how it’s supposed to be interpreted? Because so may people (yourself included) either mistakenly mistranslate the meaning, or purposively twisting the meaning. It’s really quite simple…

#40 Ron

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Posted 27 August 2010 - 02:09 PM

Why bother, Ron?

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Because it has to be explored, explained and exposed. Especially when some come here and attempt to posit opinions and “a priori” presupposition as facts instead of the faith it really is.

It's all based on faith and none of it has been observed.

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That was the most honest thing I’ve heard you say so far Harry. Unfortunately, it seems you are saying it as a joke.


Do you have a degree in sophistry?

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No, I have two degrees in Business and Business Management, and over twenty-five years experience and certifications in several electronics fields, as well as microwave/satellite technology and various weapons technologies for testing (experimentation and implementation), writing and teaching. I’m also currently completing post graduate work (two different degrees simultaneously) in Theology and Historical studies (languages, philosophy, logic, etcetera…). And when I’ve completed those, I plan on continuing the next level in both disciplines.

But your snide remark about “sophistry” is duly noted.




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