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Evolution: A Theory In Crisis


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#1 Gerson

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 01:03 AM

Nice read. the best part this guy is not a creacionist person so if you are a non-believer you should read this book from amazon comments

The author presented very convincing arguments that raised doubts about Darwin's theory of evolution. The evidence is especially convincing coming from a non-creationist. The author states that since Darwin's theory appears to be improbable, if not impossible, perhaps scientists need to develop new theories about how live began and how it progressed.

#2 JayShel

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 05:52 AM

Sounds like a good read, I would like to check it out sometime. Thanks for recommending it.

I am curious, if he isn't an evolutionist, and he isn't a creationist, he must be agnostic right?

#3 Gerson

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Posted 26 April 2012 - 12:27 PM

Sounds like a good read, I would like to check it out sometime. Thanks for recommending it.

I am curious, if he isn't an evolutionist, and he isn't a creationist, he must be agnostic right?


Yes he is.

#4 Galileo

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 05:48 AM

You can be an evolutionist and be a theist you know.

#5 JayShel

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 05:57 AM

You can be an evolutionist and be a theist you know.


Yes absolutely since theism is not equal to Christianity, and even Christians can hold both beliefs in a chaotic way through ignorance, but that doesn't really follow the line of conversation.

:running1: -OOH LOOK, A SQUIRREL!

#6 Galileo

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 06:26 AM

Yes absolutely since theism is not equal to Christianity, and even Christians can hold both beliefs in a chaotic way through ignorance, but that doesn't really follow the line of conversation.


Just sounded like you were doing what a lot of people do is say evolutionist = athiesm.

#7 Remnant of The Abyss

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 12:01 PM

Yes absolutely since theism is not equal to Christianity, and even Christians can hold both beliefs in a chaotic way through ignorance


LIKE! Posted Image



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#8 Portillo

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 05:05 PM

You can be an evolutionist and be a theist you know.


Thats what science educators want you to believe. Behind the scenes they are laughing at theistic evolutionists, because they know that evolution is a purposeless, unguided, natural process.
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#9 JayShel

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Posted 28 April 2012 - 12:48 PM

Thats what science educators want you to believe. Behind the scenes they are laughing at theistic evolutionists, because they know that evolution is a purposeless, unguided, natural process.


It depends on your religion. If you are a deist or a pantheist, or panentheist, then it doesn't really clash, but such religions do not make sense; they are man's attempt to guess at who God is and what He wants.

The deist god does not care about injustice or sin; he is a deadbeat dad that leaves before his child is born, not protecting, providing for, or guiding his children. The pantheist god (god is everything) is an ashtray, as well as the rust on my car. The panentheist and pantheist god does not hate sin because he would hate himself, since sin is a part of who he is.

Christianity is God revealing truth about Himself, His creation, and who we are throughout history. This is why it makes sense, where other man-made religions fail.

#10 Codex

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 08:19 PM

It depends on your religion. If you are a deist or a pantheist, or panentheist, then it doesn't really clash, but such religions do not make sense; they are man's attempt to guess at who God is and what He wants.

The deist god does not care about injustice or sin; he is a deadbeat dad that leaves before his child is born, not protecting, providing for, or guiding his children. The pantheist god (god is everything) is an ashtray, as well as the rust on my car. The panentheist and pantheist god does not hate sin because he would hate himself, since sin is a part of who he is.

Christianity is God revealing truth about Himself, His creation, and who we are throughout history. This is why it makes sense, where other man-made religions fail.


I'm impressed that you know about pantheism and panentheism, I've been reading quite a few of your posts and you seem like one of the more intelligent posters here, no wonder you're a moderator. I look forward to our future discussions!

Oh, and your description of deists is hilarious!

#11 Portillo

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 10:24 PM



#12 Codex

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 11:11 PM

RE: that video

Why does he think it matters what the "science education world" means when they use the term evolution? Evolution is defined by the processes involved, and the processes involved could have been designed as easily as the end result could have been designed.

I reject his entire point.

Further, Phillip E. Johnson is a retired LAW professor and is considered the father of the intelligent design movement. He is not an authority on evolutionary theory (as a former law professor) and he is not an unbiased source of information (as the "father of the intelligent design movement")

http://en.wikipedia....llip_E._Johnson

#13 Codex

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 09:53 AM

Presenting an individual as an authority who is not an authority is a fallacy. Phillip E. Johnson studied law, not evolution, not biology, not even any physical science. He is not an authority on evolution, and there is no reason to consider his opinion of it over that of actual biologists, paleontologists, geneticists, etc.

#14 gilbo12345

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 05:25 PM

Presenting an individual as an authority who is not an authority is a fallacy. Phillip E. Johnson studied law, not evolution, not biology, not even any physical science. He is not an authority on evolution, and there is no reason to consider his opinion of it over that of actual biologists, paleontologists, geneticists, etc.


He barely talked about Biology dude, he was just stating what evolutionists claim... Evolutionists claim that evolution is a purposeless, undesigned process. I can vouch for this as I've studied it the last two years and this is what is taught at university. Plus I am sure many others on here can support this with the multitude of evolutionists we have had visiting this forum.

Hence your claims here are both incorrect and mis-informed since Phillip E. Johnson wasn't discussing the Biological aspects of evolution, he was discussing the claims made by evolutionists.... Something which would fit with a law degree.

#15 Portillo

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 05:53 PM

Phillip E. Johnson was called "the most respectable academic critic of evolution" by Nobel prize winner and staunch atheist and evolutionist Steven Weinberg in his book Dreams of a Final Theory.

#16 Portillo

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 05:56 PM

Evolutionists claim that evolution is a purposeless, undesigned process. I can vouch for this as I've studied it the last two years and this is what is taught at university. Plus I am sure many others on here can support this with the multitude of evolutionists we have had visiting this forum.


Every now and then, scientific educators will come out and claim that you can believe in God and evolution. But evolution is primarily taught as a natural process, with no purpose, intelligence or God. They also make grand metaphysical claims about how the universe is purposeless and meaningless.
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#17 JayShel

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 10:35 PM

I'm impressed that you know about pantheism and panentheism, I've been reading quite a few of your posts and you seem like one of the more intelligent posters here, no wonder you're a moderator. I look forward to our future discussions!

Oh, and your description of deists is hilarious!


I guess everyone has a different sense of humor. Knowing that the deist god is a deadbeat dad, leaving his child, not providing or protecting them, I see it as a really sad hopeless worldview. It makes me depressed just thinking about it. The humor for me came later on in my post with the ashtrays and car rust :P

I think all people here are at least as intelligent as me. Some are in different stages of learning and studying. Some of us have been at this a long time. I appreciate the compliment but all glory truly belongs to Jesus.

#18 Tubal

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 02:34 AM

Presenting an individual as an authority who is not an authority is a fallacy. Phillip E. Johnson studied law, not evolution, not biology, not even any physical science. He is not an authority on evolution, and there is no reason to consider his opinion of it over that of actual biologists, paleontologists, geneticists, etc.


Even if an donkey speaks the truth will you reject it because a donkey said it? By just looking at the person and not listening to what he is saying is not really a good way to grow intellectually. Not only has this student of law said this but prominent Biologists, Zoologists, Geneticists and an array of people from diverse fields have said similar things against evolution. You still do not consider their opinions not because of who said it but because you simply don't want to out of convenience at this point. When stripping a person of scientific credibility doesn't work you just ignore the arguments completely.
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#19 gilbo12345

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 05:07 PM

Every now and then, scientific educators will come out and claim that you can believe in God and evolution. But evolution is primarily taught as a natural process, with no purpose, intelligence or God. They also make grand metaphysical claims about how the universe is purposeless and meaningless.


Some do, some don't, some even admit that there is some kind of "driving force" behind the world. I've had plenty of chats with my lecturers from different areas of science so it is interesting in the diversity of opinions. Though I must concur that the majority of the evolutionists have been of the "random process" camp.

#20 Springer

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 11:25 AM

Yes he is.

I've read Denton's book... very well written and a lot of excellent points. The reason that evolution remains a viable theory is obvious. Intelligent design has been arbitrarily dismissed as "unscientific" for reasons of political correctness. Therefore, evolution has become the only possible explanation for life. This is a classic case of the fallacy of the false alternative. Evolution is accepted only because it is deemed by "scientists" to be less absurd than a belief in God. None of its precepts are even close to provable by the scientific method. Furthermore, a belief in Darwinism requires a rejection of known facts of science, most specificially probability concepts.




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