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It's becoming more clear every day that with respect to COVID-19 and our handling of it that we simply blew it.  The difference between the EU and the USA pretty clearly shows it.

A graph comparing new coronavirus cases in the US and Europe.
 
 
Here's the growth rate of the virus in mid-May....
 
This map, reflecting data as of May 13, 2020, shows the percentage change in the average number of new cases each day over the week ending yesterday compared to the same number for the previous week.
 
and in late June
Image
 (Graphics from CNN presenting Johns Hopkins University data)
 
This isn't just the number of cases .... hospitals are filling up and the death curve is flattening.  It's pretty clear we've lost a lot of ground.
In the next week or so, the number of deaths per day can be expected to increase.
 
IMHO, there are multiple causes for this situation.   Among them, not a single state met CDC criteria when they reopened.  Then there was a broad disregard for the guidelines in terms of testing and contact tracing.  Compound that with large, generally maskless gatherings.
 
It was a recipe for disaster .... and it looks very much like we're going to get it.
 
The question is ..... what do we do now?
 
 

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21 hours ago, piasan said:

It's becoming more clear every day that with respect to COVID-19 and our handling of it that we simply blew it.  The difference between the EU and the USA pretty clearly shows it.

A graph comparing new coronavirus cases in the US and Europe.
 
 
Here's the growth rate of the virus in mid-May....
 
This map, reflecting data as of May 13, 2020, shows the percentage change in the average number of new cases each day over the week ending yesterday compared to the same number for the previous week.
 
and in late June
Image
 (Graphics from CNN presenting Johns Hopkins University data)
 
This isn't just the number of cases .... hospitals are filling up and the death curve is flattening.  It's pretty clear we've lost a lot of ground.
In the next week or so, the number of deaths per day can be expected to increase.
 
IMHO, there are multiple causes for this situation.   Among them, not a single state met CDC criteria when they reopened.  Then there was a broad disregard for the guidelines in terms of testing and contact tracing.  Compound that with large, generally maskless gatherings.
 
It was a recipe for disaster .... and it looks very much like we're going to get it.
 
The question is ..... what do we do now?
 
 

And there has been this constant push to reopen as fast as possible, get back to normal, etc.  I hate to say it, but I called it.  I knew this was going to happen.  What should we do???  Ask the EU....

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23 hours ago, piasan said:
The question is ..... what do we do now?

the answer is so obvious i'm surprised you missed it.

have more riots like missourri and washington state had.

that way we can have flocks of people hanging out together without worrying about a little ol' virus.

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It's all a big hoax and a fake news lame-stream media lie. Trump said the virus will go away like a miracle in April. It is now July; get a grip libtards. The kung flu is a Chinese bio weapon that has been in the US for months if not years; 90% or so of the American population had already been exposed to the virus and has developed an immunity. Children cannot even get the disease. All this social distancing and face masks is a liberal plot to take away our freedoms. Masks are literally killing people!

Even if this is a real pandemic, I'm sure all the old people are willing to die to ensure the economic prosperity of America. It is a great day for all those that have died from corona; looking down on America and our great economic success.

(All ideas taken directly from things I've heard from conservatives, concerned citizens, or the President.)

My point being, the greatest plans in the world won't help you if a significant portion of your population is living in an alternate reality, or otherwise feels that corona is an acceptable consequence to keeping the economy at full speed. Then, of course, we have the "greatest jobs President God ever created" saying we need to slow down testing so the numbers don't bruise his ego.

The next year or so is going to be really interesting.

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9 hours ago, Goku said:

get a grip libtards.

 

libtards?

aren't you worried that someone with sensitive skin will be offended by such a remark?

how dare you to make fun of the mentally handicapped, i think i'll go riot and burn the place down.

Quote

kung flu

racist.

Quote

The next year or so is going to be really interesting.

we will probably build the next maginold line where we will march all of our warriors into tunnels.

 

i understand your post all to well goku, great job.

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On 7/2/2020 at 6:11 PM, StormanNorman said:

And there has been this constant push to reopen as fast as possible, get back to normal, etc.  I hate to say it, but I called it.  I knew this was going to happen.  What should we do???  Ask the EU....

I think we both called it.

We can had the EU and a bunch of other nations leading the way by weeks.   All we really needed to do was mimic their behavior.   Frankly, none of that is new either.... we've known for a long time how to deal with epidemics.   The only real difference between epidemics and pandemics is the geography.  

Handling the disease is pretty much the same .... find out who is carrying the disease and isolate them.

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On 7/2/2020 at 7:36 PM, what if said:

the answer is so obvious i'm surprised you missed it.

have more riots like missourri and washington state had.

that way we can have flocks of people hanging out together without worrying about a little ol' virus.

Riots are far from the only places we've had mass gatherings of people that aren't worrying about the virus.  Bars, restaurants,

The results are already tragically obvious .... it's only a matter of days before it shows up in the death toll ......

The CDC is now predicting 148,000 dead by July 25.   We're now at about 130,000.    That's 18,000 dead in 21 days or 857 per day.  Right now, we're losing something more than 500 a day.  That means the AVERAGE toll will need to rise by about 700 a day to 1200.   I've heard we could be looking at 200,000 dead by the beginning of October.

Unless we change our behavior NOW, I fear that will be on the low side by a lot.

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On 7/3/2020 at 12:12 PM, Goku said:

My point being, the greatest plans in the world won't help you if a significant portion of your population is living in an alternate reality, or otherwise feels that corona is an acceptable consequence to keeping the economy at full speed. ....

The next year or so is going to be really interesting.

We always knew opening the economy was going to cost lives.

That we have done it with a near total disregard for having in place things we needed to have in order to open the economy safely is going to cause tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths.

As the curse says .... "May you live in interesting times."   We certainly are.

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47 minutes ago, piasan said:

Riots are far from the only places we've had mass gatherings of people that aren't worrying about the virus.  Bars, restaurants,

The results are already tragically obvious .... it's only a matter of days before it shows up in the death toll ......

The CDC is now predicting 148,000 dead by July 25.   We're now at about 130,000.    That's 18,000 dead in 21 days or 857 per day.  Right now, we're losing something more than 500 a day.  That means the AVERAGE toll will need to rise by about 700 a day to 1200.   I've heard we could be looking at 200,000 dead by the beginning of October.

Unless we change our behavior NOW, I fear that will be on the low side by a lot.

it's really hard for me to get excited about this virus.

our local community isn't blessed by god or anything so i don't see how it could be any different than any other community. our community has suffered only 5 confirmed deaths from this virus and over 95% of the population do not wear masks and i've only seen 1 person wear gloves, 2 if you count me.

various reports i've seen suggests this virus isn't easily transmitted between humans, one report that traced this virus from saudi arabia to the UK to canada to china even explicitly states such. this same report says that china "weaponized" this virus which might have changed that.

so, what exactly am i to believe piasan? do i believe what is happening locally or do i believe something almost opposite that is happening elsewhere?

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19 hours ago, what if said:

it's really hard for me to get excited about this virus.

our local community isn't blessed by god or anything so i don't see how it could be any different than any other community. our community has suffered only 5 confirmed deaths from this virus and over 95% of the population do not wear masks and i've only seen 1 person wear gloves, 2 if you count me.

various reports i've seen suggests this virus isn't easily transmitted between humans, one report that traced this virus from saudi arabia to the UK to canada to china even explicitly states such. this same report says that china "weaponized" this virus which might have changed that.

so, what exactly am i to believe piasan? do i believe what is happening locally or do i believe something almost opposite that is happening elsewhere?

Well, I don't know anything about your local community so I can't comment.  In my case, the county I live in has only 1 death and adjoining counties have 2 more.  But this is a very rural area so the spread will be exceedingly slow.   The situation is very different in urban areas and places where lots of people congregate.  We have about the same percentage wearing masks as you.  I do wear a mask but not gloves, but I have a bottle of 91% alcohol and clean my hands every time I get in the car.

The path Covid took to get here and the source of the virus don't change the fact that it's here and we need to deal with it.  With the crowds on July 4, it's pretty obvious far too many people aren't taking this thing seriously.

As to what to believe .... well, I believe this thing is spread by people who don't even know they've been exposed.  That makes this stuff exceedingly dangerous.  I believe the way we have gone about reopening has blown most, if not all, of what we gained by the shutdown.  I also believe Covid is now so widespread we are unable to use contact tracing as an effective containment measure.   All of this means we're in for some very bad exponential growth in the next few months.

What to do about personal safety ..... well, I suggest you watch local conditions and act prudently.

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One can only imagine if Biden was president instead of Trump and DIDN'T stop flights from coming in or out of China to the USA on Jan 31 like Trump did, AGAINST many advisers wishes..

(Oh, Biden called Trump Xenophobic for doing so)

Biden FINALLY came around on April 3rd!! A full 2 MONTHS LATER!!!

Who knows how many millions of lives would have been lost under the "politically correct" Government funded Abortionist administration of one Joe Biden....

 

https://www.cerescourier.com/opinion/editorial/biden-flips-china-travel-ban/

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On 7/4/2020 at 7:53 PM, what if said:

it's really hard for me to get excited about this virus.

our local community isn't blessed by god or anything so i don't see how it could be any different than any other community. our community has suffered only 5 confirmed deaths from this virus and over 95% of the population do not wear masks and i've only seen 1 person wear gloves, 2 if you count me.

various reports i've seen suggests this virus isn't easily transmitted between humans, one report that traced this virus from saudi arabia to the UK to canada to china even explicitly states such. this same report says that china "weaponized" this virus which might have changed that.

so, what exactly am i to believe piasan? do i believe what is happening locally or do i believe something almost opposite that is happening elsewhere?

"our local community isn't blessed by god or anything"

How do you know that?

You CANNOT know that!

Did you know that?

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1 hour ago, piasan said:

Well, I don't know anything about your local community so I can't comment.  In my case, the county I live in has only 1 death and adjoining counties have 2 more.  But this is a very rural area so the spread will be exceedingly slow.

 

the community i live in is approximately 10,000 people. it isn't a large city but it isn't small either.

the last i checked the death rate we had just past the 5% mark, 5% of the known cases had died. i recently left the house to pay my bills and get some groceries and about the only people i seen wearing masks were store employees. i know this much, i'm what you would call "at risk" for this virus and i'm going to wear my mask when i go out amongst the people. the gloves just make sense seeing as i gotta punch numbers concerning my debit card. jeez, i never thought i would ever have a debit card but i wouldn't want to live without one. i just don't like having a lot of cash on my person. the only downside, if you want to call it that, is i don't have a lot of change to feed miss piggy. in case you're wondering miss piggy is my piggy bank. it can hold about a hundred bucks in change and when i got it full i would chuck it in the bank. i've gotten to where i will stash a dollar or 2 in various places around the house to make up for that.

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13 minutes ago, Blitzking said:

"our local community isn't blessed by god or anything"

How do you know that?

You CANNOT know that!

Did you know that?

no, i didn't know that.

how did you know i didn't know that.

you know, i just don't know how you could know i didn't know that, you know?

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On 7/4/2020 at 9:36 PM, piasan said:

I think we both called it.

We can had the EU and a bunch of other nations leading the way by weeks.   All we really needed to do was mimic their behavior.   Frankly, none of that is new either.... we've known for a long time how to deal with epidemics.   The only real difference between epidemics and pandemics is the geography.  

Handling the disease is pretty much the same .... find out who is carrying the disease and isolate them.

I would also say take the other measures....social distancing, masks, etc......seriously.......and isolate the vulnerable, if you can. 

We just had a pretty big uptick in cases here in Pittsburgh.  As it turns out, it was from the bars.....mainly the 21-25 year old hang-outs.  I just saw July 4 images from Michigan (my home state) with 20+ year old kids all crammed into the water, partying, beach balls bouncing around, etc.  Just plain stupid.  As another potential solution, maybe we should temporarily raise the drinking age to 40 or something (good news is that I can still throw em' back:yes:)

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16 hours ago, Blitzking said:

One can only imagine if Biden was president instead of Trump and DIDN'T stop flights from coming in or out of China to the USA on Jan 31 like Trump did, AGAINST many advisers wishes..

(Oh, Biden called Trump Xenophobic for doing so)

Biden FINALLY came around on April 3rd!! A full 2 MONTHS LATER!!!

Who knows how many millions of lives would have been lost under the "politically correct" Government funded Abortionist administration of one Joe Biden....

Biden has previous experience dealing with pandemics.   More likely than not he would have left the pandemic office in the White House and been alerted early on.  He would realize there's a lot more to this than simply declaring a travel ban.

The fact is the travel restrictions with China made little real difference.  Partly because Covid also entered from Europe for a full two weeks after the restrictions were in place.  Partly because the virus was already here.

The fact is that Trump did NOTHING during the month of February to prepare for the virus.

The fact is that Trump, as the nation began to reopen, urged governors to disregard the CDC guidelines in the process.  (Note:  This is a significant factor in our current situation.)

The fact is that Trump has mocked and ridiculed people and jurisdictions who HAVE followed CDC guidelines.

The fact is that Trump has declared "VICTORY" in the "war" against the virus .... despite the fact that more than 500 Americans are dying every day from it.

The fact is that Trump argues for reduced testing so we won't have so many cases.  

It's clear that Trump's strategy going forward is to pack as many auditoriums as he can while his followers are infecting each other in the stands.

He seems to care more about retaining the heritage of the Confederacy than the lives of his supporters.

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8 hours ago, StormanNorman said:

I would also say take the other measures....social distancing, masks, etc......seriously.......and isolate the vulnerable, if you can.

Absolutely.

8 hours ago, StormanNorman said:

We just had a pretty big uptick in cases here in Pittsburgh.  As it turns out, it was from the bars.....mainly the 21-25 year old hang-outs.  I just saw July 4 images from Michigan (my home state) with 20+ year old kids all crammed into the water, partying, beach balls bouncing around, etc.  Just plain stupid. 

Yep.

Other areas are finding it's the bars too.   I'm much more concerned about bars than beaches.   As I understand it, some areas are considering going back to a full lockdown.

 

8 hours ago, StormanNorman said:

As another potential solution, maybe we should temporarily raise the drinking age to 40 or something (good news is that I can still throw em' back:yes:)

My father was a wholesale beer, wine, and liquor distributor.   In high school, I had a key to the warehouse.  It drove my friends nuts that I wasn't helping myself once in a while.  (Why bother, we had a bar at home?)

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7 hours ago, piasan said:

Biden has previous experience dealing with pandemics.   More likely than not he would have left the pandemic office in the White House and been alerted early on.  He would realize there's a lot more to this than simply declaring a travel ban.

The fact is the travel restrictions with China made little real difference.  Partly because Covid also entered from Europe for a full two weeks after the restrictions were in place.  Partly because the virus was already here.

The fact is that Trump did NOTHING during the month of February to prepare for the virus.

The fact is that Trump, as the nation began to reopen, urged governors to disregard the CDC guidelines in the process.  (Note:  This is a significant factor in our current situation.)

The fact is that Trump has mocked and ridiculed people and jurisdictions who HAVE followed CDC guidelines.

The fact is that Trump has declared "VICTORY" in the "war" against the virus .... despite the fact that more than 500 Americans are dying every day from it.

The fact is that Trump argues for reduced testing so we won't have so many cases.  

It's clear that Trump's strategy going forward is to pack as many auditoriums as he can while his followers are infecting each other in the stands.

He seems to care more about retaining the heritage of the Confederacy than the lives of his supporters.

FAKE NEWS!! 

But you dont care.. Just as long as they tell you what your itching TDS ears want to hear.. 

During times of war the first casualty is the truth, The Left is on the warpath, The right better wake up and realize it before it is too late.. 

GET THE IDEA?

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On 7/6/2020 at 5:39 PM, piasan said:

The fact is that Trump did NOTHING during the month of February to prepare for the virus.

The fact is that Trump, as the nation began to reopen, urged governors to disregard the CDC guidelines in the process.  (Note:  This is a significant factor in our current situation.)

The fact is that Trump has mocked and ridiculed people and jurisdictions who HAVE followed CDC guidelines.

The fact is that Trump has declared "VICTORY" in the "war" against the virus .... despite the fact that more than 500 Americans are dying every day from it.

The fact is that Trump argues for reduced testing so we won't have so many cases.  

It's clear that Trump's strategy going forward is to pack as many auditoriums as he can while his followers are infecting each other in the stands.

He seems to care more about retaining the heritage of the Confederacy than the lives of his supporters.

On 7/7/2020 at 1:29 AM, Blitzking said:

FAKE NEWS!! 

But you dont care.. Just as long as they tell you what your itching TDS ears want to hear..

 

Is it fake news?    The please show me:

  • What Trump did in February to prepare for a potentially serious epidemic.
  • That Trump encouraged states to reopen strictly according to guidelines established by HIS task force.
  • That Trump praised (instead of ridiculed) those officials who delayed reopening because their jurisdictions did not meet the guidelines for reopening.
  • That Trump is not NOW minimizing the severity of this pandemic ..... or that we are not losing more than 500 Americans a day to Covid.
  • That Trump supports increased testing so we can identify and trace people who are infected.
  • That Trump encourages social distancing OR face masks at his events.

But you don't care because you believe Trump's election was an act of Divine Providence.   Therefore, he is ordained by God to be president and can do no wrong.

Your TWS (Trump Worship Syndrome) blinds you to Trumps self-serving malfeasance in the handling of this deadly crisis.

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56 minutes ago, piasan said:

Is it fake news?    The please show me:

  • What Trump did in February to prepare for a potentially serious epidemic.
  • That Trump encouraged states to reopen strictly according to guidelines established by HIS task force.
  • That Trump praised (instead of ridiculed) those officials who delayed reopening because their jurisdictions did not meet the guidelines for reopening.
  • That Trump is not NOW minimizing the severity of this pandemic ..... or that we are not losing more than 500 Americans a day to Covid.
  • That Trump supports increased testing so we can identify and trace people who are infected.
  • That Trump encourages social distancing OR face masks at his events.

But you don't care because you believe Trump's election was an act of Divine Providence.   Therefore, he is ordained by God to be president and can do no wrong.

Your TWS (Trump Worship Syndrome) blinds you to Trumps self-serving malfeasance in the handling of this deadly crisis.

Yes.. We are in an ideological war with you Democrat supporters and the casualty has been the truth.. Fake News!  

Just like the Fake Science of Evolutionism that you shoved down gullible kids throats at taxpayer expense 

LOTS OF DECEPTION.

Just like your phoney Russian witch hunt hoax that has been completely destroyed debunked and exposed and a orchestrated fraud using the intelligence communities.  

But people like you still believe it!! 

But the Bible say that You will reap what you have sown.. No wonder you dont want the Bible to be true..

Have a wonderful evening!

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59 minutes ago, piasan said:

Is it fake news?    The please show me:

  • What Trump did in February to prepare for a potentially serious epidemic.
  • That Trump encouraged states to reopen strictly according to guidelines established by HIS task force.
  • That Trump praised (instead of ridiculed) those officials who delayed reopening because their jurisdictions did not meet the guidelines for reopening.
  • That Trump is not NOW minimizing the severity of this pandemic ..... or that we are not losing more than 500 Americans a day to Covid.
  • That Trump supports increased testing so we can identify and trace people who are infected.
  • That Trump encourages social distancing OR face masks at his events.

But you don't care because you believe Trump's election was an act of Divine Providence.   Therefore, he is ordained by God to be president and can do no wrong.

Your TWS (Trump Worship Syndrome) blinds you to Trumps self-serving malfeasance in the handling of this deadly crisis.

"You believe that Trumps election was an act of divine providence"

Yes I do...  I guess it is hard for Evolutionists to understand concepts like "Divine Providence" though..

Did you see the supreme court sided with the Little Sisters of the Poor today? That was probably very distressing for you to read about and you cant wait for Biden to get in so maybe they will figure out a way to reverse it somehow by hook or by crook..

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The number of cases  has been increasing for about a month.  

Now, the number of deaths is making the anticipated turn upward. 

(Charts from:  https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/ )   ####  EDIT   Charts did not display and were deleted. ######

Since the number of cases is a leading indicator for the number of deaths, this horrible trend is likely to persist for some time. 

Today the number of cases exceeded 60,000.  If only 2% die, that will be 1200 dead.  Fauci has testified the number of cases could rise to 100,000 a day.

Latest estimates are that we will exceed 200,000 dead by November 1.  The good news is the same estimates indicate we could save 45,000 by just diligently wearing masks.

This would be a good time for the leadership of this country to actively promote the wearing of masks by EVERYONE  ... it could save TENS OF THOUSANDS of lives.

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Today Trump announced he is going to pressure governors to reopen schools in the fall.  The CDC issued guidelines for doing so safely.

Trump overruled the CDC and declared the guidelines are "too tough" and expensive.  The CDC is reviewing the guidance.

This on a day when we had 60,000 new cases ..... and increasing.  

At a time when the number of cases is increasing in 35 states and declining in only 3,  Trump is being guided by neither science nor safety.

Everyone wants everything open.  Me too.   The problem is how to do it safely.

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2 hours ago, piasan said:

Is it fake news?    The please show me:

  • What Trump did in February to prepare for a potentially serious epidemic.
  • That Trump encouraged states to reopen strictly according to guidelines established by HIS task force.
  • That Trump praised (instead of ridiculed) those officials who delayed reopening because their jurisdictions did not meet the guidelines for reopening.
  • That Trump is not NOW minimizing the severity of this pandemic ..... or that we are not losing more than 500 Americans a day to Covid.
  • That Trump supports increased testing so we can identify and trace people who are infected.
  • That Trump encourages social distancing OR face masks at his events.
1 hour ago, Blitzking said:

Yes.. We are in an ideological war with you Democrat supporters and the casualty has been the truth.. Fake News! 

 

Failure to show any of my statements were false noted.

 

1 hour ago, Blitzking said:

Have a wonderful evening!

You too.  

Come back any time you have something substantive to offer. 

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11 minutes ago, piasan said:

Failure to show any of my statements were false noted.

 

You too.  

Come back any time you have something substantive to offer. 

How about the supreme court ruling on the Little Sisters of the Poor? 

Was that "Substantive" enough for you?

Are you upset because Trump won that case? 

 

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